RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

General Chit Chat about Sinclair Computers and their Clones
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RetroTechie
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by RetroTechie »

Hi Paul,

Depends on the CD-ROM, hey? Personally I'd toss that CD-ROM in the bin. And perhaps that book, too. :P

C++ is a programming language that's much used today, especially in large / complex projects. But (from what I've read), not easy to get started with, and even harder to master. There's a lot of bad C++ code out there that results from programmers not understanding the subtleties of the language. This is more a language that you'd 'run into' and pick up as a professional coder, I think.

C on the other hand, is a much simpler, low-level language. Often described as "portable assembly". That is: assembly-like, but cross-platform. A much more rewarding language to begin with I'd say, especially if you like coding 'close to the metal' and want to apply the skills learned on other platforms too. And not going out of fashion, either. Unlike some high-level languages that seem to rise & fall in popularity like stock options. :lol:

Btw. have you thought about what sort of programs you'd like to write? :?: (the "red line" through this thread, really)
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monsterjazzlicks
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by monsterjazzlicks »

Thanks RetroTechie,
RetroTechie wrote:Depends on the CD-ROM, hey? Personally I'd toss that CD-ROM in the bin. And perhaps that book, too.
Well that's probably WHY the shop gave it to me for FREE! lol It actually cost £28.99 in 1998!
RetroTechie wrote:Btw. have you thought about what sort of programs you'd like to write?
I am going to learn PYTHON and buy a RPi (latest model). Off into the future, I would like to be able to fuse what I learn with my knowledge of electronic music/instruments. Many musicians on various forums I frequent use PYTHON and there are already lots of (musical) softwares written in this language. I was also reading this page a few days ago about it's usage:

https://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonInMusic

And at some point, a SINCLAIR SPECTRUM (pref the one with the built-in cassette player) purely for GAMING. I am keeping an eye out on SELL MY RETRO. Of which I wanted to ask, please: can you use the cassette player to connect to other devices (via a regular DIN lead)? I have a couple of 1980's synthesizers were you can LOAD/SAVE data (ie sounds) to a cassette via a dedicated port. And so I wondered if I could use the SPECTRUM cassette player for these tasks? Or will the cassette player only function for SPECTRUM duties ?

Cheers,

Paul
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by 1024MAK »

The built in mono cassette decks on computers including the Amstrad made Sinclair ZX Spectrum +2 (coloured dark grey), and the Amstrad made Sinclair ZX Spectrum +2A and +2B (both coloured black), are really only intended for loading and saving computer programs.

The audio connector (a 3.5mm jack socket) on the Spectrums only give limited access to some of the signals (a mono output designed mainly for use for feeding to an audio amp and speakers so you can hear the sound from the computer).

There are no "standard" audio DIN sockets on any ZX Spectrum model. The DIN sockets you may see in photos are the video/RGB socket and the power input (+2A, +2B and +3).

Mark
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by monsterjazzlicks »

Hi Mark,
1024MAK wrote:The built in mono cassette decks on computers including the Amstrad made Sinclair ZX Spectrum +2 (coloured dark grey), and the Amstrad made Sinclair ZX Spectrum +2A and +2B (both coloured black), are really only intended for loading and saving computer programs.

The audio connector (a 3.5mm jack socket) on the Spectrums only give limited access to some of the signals (a mono output designed mainly for use for feeding to an audio amp and speakers so you can hear the sound from the computer).

There are no "standard" audio DIN sockets on any ZX Spectrum model. The DIN sockets you may see in photos are the video/RGB socket and the power input (+2A, +2B and +3).
Ok, thanks very much for the information.

Yes, you could use the MONO OUTPUT to hook up to external speakers so that you could listen to the games soundtrack/FX hi-fi style.

Apparently, you could use COMPUTER CASSETTE PLAYERS with the Yamaha DX Synths for STORAGE because it is not actual SAMPLES of the instruments that were being transfered between the two devices. But rather audio-streams of System-Exclusive messages which were (I am quite sure) just BINARY CODING (and had that same awful screeching sound the computer produced when loading game data).

Here are a couple of paragraphs I gleaned from a thread discussing this question:
Yes you need a Mono cassette RECORDER - the sort that has a built in speaker and an earphone socket. That will have what you need - A VOLUME CONTROL.

Stereo cassette decks (which are more common) don't cut it generally - as they have fixed level line-out.

If the headphone socket has a volume control, then it might work using THAT socket.
Assuming the cables are the same for all the YAMAHA DX synths that supported cassettes, I’ve seen them advertised for one or more models at various times on eBay, though none at the moment. The architecture presumably isn’t anything complex, just a DIN to audio jacks. I have one somewhere for an Amstrad CPC 6128 that is probably similar, maybe identical. A local music or electronic shop could probably put one together for a fairly cheap price given the specification, which will be in the service manual.
So, I just think you need a DIN CONNECTOR (for the DX synth end) and a 3.5mm MINI JACK OUT for the CASSETTE PLAYER end)?

Thanks,

Paul
Last edited by monsterjazzlicks on Sat Mar 07, 2015 1:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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RetroTechie
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by RetroTechie »

Just got some full HD (1920x1080, h264 encoded) video to play on my RPi. Amazingly takes just a few % CPU (so that's hardware acceleration at work). And the central SoC doesn't heat up at all (at least, not noticeable). 8-) Okay a decent smartphone can do the same these days. But it's still impressive if you realize how much "heavy lifting" is involved in decoding full HD, h264 encoded video.

Although I must say the default audio / video setup using Raspbian seems a bit messed up. :( On PC's (with 1000s of different audio & video hardware) I'm used to very minor tinkering when moving a HDD from one machine to the next. Yet on the RPi with only 1 video chip and 1 audio chip to support (by default, that is), a popular video player like VLC does nothing. Whatever the reason(s), that's just plain silly. :evil:
monsterjazzlicks wrote:Appanently, you could use COMPUTER CASSETTE PLAYERS with the Yamaha DX Synths for STORAGE because it is not actual SAMPLES of the instruments that were being transfered between the two devices. But rather audio-streams of System-Exclusive messages which were (I am quite sure) just BINARY CODING (and had that same awful screeching sound the computer produced when loading game data).
Sounds like you want some MIDI interface hardware to go with that Raspberry Pi. :mrgreen: Then you could (for example) have a synthesizer/keyboard play a song through its MIDI OUT port, and capture that data on the RPi. Or grab a .mid file, use the RPi to send it to a synthesizer module, and have that play the song using its high-quality built in sample banks. And possibly in between make some edits to that MIDI data, and/or have some software do fun stuff with it.

With that in hand, no point in messing with tape recorders of any kind (imho).

For some ideas / links, Google for "Raspberry Pi MIDI interface" or similar (without quotes).
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by monsterjazzlicks »

Hi RetroTechie,
RetroTechie wrote:Sounds like you want some MIDI interface hardware to go with that Raspberry Pi. :mrgreen: Then you could (for example) have a synthesizer/keyboard play a song through its MIDI OUT port, and capture that data on the RPi. Or grab a .mid file, use the RPi to send it to a synthesizer module, and have that play the song using its high-quality built in sample banks. And possibly in between make some edits to that MIDI data, and/or have some software do fun stuff with it.

With that in hand, no point in messing with tape recorders of any kind (imho).

For some ideas / links, Google for "Raspberry Pi MIDI interface" or similar (without quotes).
Yes, that is all very true. And yes, this is the avenue I would like to explore (via an RPi). I think I mentioned this a few pages back.

The reason for asking about CASSETTE PLAYERS was because back in the 1980's when I owned my first Yamaha DX synth, this was the method everyone used. However, I (as well as many other DX owners) could not ever seem to get this system to work. It became evident that this was because of the TYPE of CASSETTE PLAYER being used (ie it needs to be a COMPUTER type model rather than a regular music/hi-fi one). And so I was wondering out of curiousity if the ZX SPECTRUM one would be (have been) suffice. The second factor in this issue was the TYPE of CASSETTES being used. These need(ed) to be the C-5 / C-10 / C-20 type.

And when I do buy a ZX SPECTRUM I would like to try this out just to see how it would have worked.

Cheers,

Paul
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by stefano »

The Standard ZX Spectrum's encoding was quite robust and I saw games being loaded from crap walkmans as well as from almost any type of audio set.
The more important trick was to get a good recording. This could be achieved setting the recording volume correctly. The best recorders were the simple MONO ones, because they were writing over a thick portion of the tape and they did not have odd BIAS options.
Impedance was not very critical.

Oppositely the ZX81 is a bad beast.. some recorders work better but you need to experiment quite a bit to avoid bad surprises !
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by monsterjazzlicks »

Hi Stefano,
stefano wrote:The Standard ZX Spectrum's encoding was quite robust and I saw games being loaded from crap walkmans as well as from almost any type of audio set.
The more important trick was to get a good recording. This could be achieved setting the recording volume correctly. The best recorders were the simple MONO ones, because they were writing over a thick portion of the tape and they did not have odd BIAS options.
Impedance was not very critical.

Oppositely the ZX81 is a bad beast.. some recorders work better but you need to experiment quite a bit to avoid bad surprises !
On the DX synthesizers, these were extremely sensitive to LEVELS and any BIAS settings. They would just crash when LOADIND/SAVING. And also users were advised to use a CASSETTE PLAYER with a MONO out.

Cheers,

Paul
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by stefano »

I had a Korg POLY-800.. no problems with it, and it patterns were sounds very close to the Spectrum's one..
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Re: RE : (Newbie Hello! / ZX Advice Please?)

Post by monsterjazzlicks »

Hi Stefano,
stefano wrote:I had a Korg POLY-800.. no problems with it, and it patterns were sounds very close to the Spectrum's one..
What do you mean by 'patterns' please?

I think that a lot of 1980's computers used a YAMAHA SOUND CHIP from the DX7 synth.

Did you ever SAVE/LOAD data from your POLY-800 to CASSETTE TAPE like I was describing above?

Cheers,

Paul
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